Ford has recalled the EcoSport three times so far. Ford says the bad weld is between the A-bracket on the front seatback and the side member. Ford supplies the EcoSport with a three-year/60,000-mile warranty as standard, and the package includes a year’s paint defect cover and a 12-year … Common problems with the Ford Ecosport. Search Cars, VIN, Body Style… Search Cars, VIN, Body Style… 2018 Ford EcoSport Owner Reviews & Common Problems Change Year 2021 2020 2019 2018 Overview. 2013 Ford EcoSport the key won’t turn in the ignition. What's Wrong with the 2nd Generation EcoSport? It might not be the best crossover in its class but examples from 2018 onwards are much better than earlier models. Ford will compensate thousands of its drivers affected by the recent EcoBoost engine problems which have been exposed. 4 Models & Specs. Ford EcoSport is a subcompact crossover bult by Ford in Brazil, thanks to it’s popularity and success it was launched in other regions, including Thailand, Russia and Romania. Hoping there’s better luck with ford. DISCLAIMER: fordownersclub.com is an independent Ford forum for owners of Ford vehicles. That said, the model debuted in the U.S. in 2018, which makes it difficult to gauge its long-term performance. Ford is recalling a small number of 2019 EcoSports because an insufficient weld may reduce the strength of the front seats in a crash. I have had my 2018 125 ST line 3 weeks now and managed to put 1000 miles on it. Get answers and make your voice heard! Some problems will only occur after many years of operation, others are related to technical solutions and forced the manufacturer to issue a recall. 13.2K views. Trending articles. For more information on how we collect and use this information, please review our Privacy Policy. Learn what consumers really think. [8] The image shown is of Titanium+ (AT only) variant. There was auxiliary power inside but no response from the engine even after receiving a jump. Share your story and help others address these problems, or consult with an on-line mechanic. Learn More. I purchase a new 2018 Ford Ecosport. Share your complaints and discuss all related problems. The Ford EcoSport placed 78th out of 100 in our Driver Power owner satisfaction survey. We've pulled together a list of the most widespread problems that EcoSport owners have to deal with. The first came in April 2015 because of possible fuel leaks due to corrosion of the fuel lines. We offer one of the largest collection of Ford Ecosport related news, gallery and technical articles. Helpful 1 Gavyn H wrote on November 20, 2020 Great family car for the money. Thousands of owners could … The Ford EcoSport also sports many features designed to provide greater traction in snowy conditions. Front ¾ vehicle photos © 1986-2018 Autodata, Inc. dba Chrome Data. The problem is, the first Ecosport to be offered in the UK, arriving in 2014, didn’t earn a particularly good reputation. This section identifies potential problems, causes and fixes based on the experiences of owners and repairers, online sources and technical service bulletins. Ford Ecosport Forum > Ecosport Forums Sub-Forums: Ecosport Forums: Search this Forum : Forum: Last Post: Threads: Posts: old post: New Member Introductions . This information may be used by NHTSA during the investigation process. Found the Ford EcoSport of your dreams? Huge overhaul for Ford's unloved crossover Refreshed look, interior and engine range We drive two iterations of the new Ecosport. [9] Ford EcoSport Titanium, Titanium + (AT only) & S variants come with sporty design 205/60 R16 Alloy. FORD ECOSPORT PROBLEMS, CUSTOMER SERVICE AND STUPIDITY. Home > Cars > ECOSPORT > Features > Safety & Security. Though some may be less significant than others, they should still be factored into the choice. The EcoSport has 1 generation available in North American markets. It has been revealed that the company has found multiple problems in the EcoSport that includes - faulty brake, fuel lines and rear seat backrest. Although the 2014 Ford EcoSport has the most overall complaints, we rate the 2018 model year as worse because of other possible factors such as higher repair cost or more problems at lower mileage. Gavlar77. : 2. A sign of a civilian-spec Explorer Hybrid? Make Room for More. 335: 1,617: old post: Eecosportownersclub.co.uk Site Issues and help. The problem is, as with any engine, there are going to be problems. Official recalls have been issued for the 2020 Ford EcoSport by the NHTSA. Ford Ecosport Forum is the premier Ford Ecosport community. more . Its overall PainRank™ of 1.47 is based on relative complaint analysis from 7 owner complaints sent to CarComplaints.com over 8 model years. Below is a list of complaints & problems filed against the 2018 FORD ECOSPORT.These problems includes information received by NHTSA from consumers either directly or as recorded by the Vehicle Safety Hotline. Its PainRank™ score of 0.84 ranks 15th out of 94 eligible generations in reliability.The score is based on relative complaint analysis of the 11 owners complaints on CarComplaints.com.A majority of the complaints are about transmission problems.. Join Date: Jun 2018. Front ¾ vehicle photos © 1986-2018 Autodata, Inc. dba Chrome Data. The coolant hose on the 1.0 Ecoboost engines of cars built between October 2011 and … Ford EcoSport Tuning "Ta for reading this Ford EcoSport tuning guide." I recently traded my 2014 Ford Fiesta on a 2015 Ford Ecosport after the transmission failed. There's really been no significant problems reported in relation to the 1.5 EcoBoost engine. Common problems with the Ford Ecosport. What problems do Ford Ecosport Engine drivers report? Documenting the process of troubleshooting common problems. 2016 Ford Ecosport 1.0 140 Titanium S review. Ford will compensate thousands of its drivers affected by the recent EcoBoost engine problems which have been exposed. The Ford EcoSport can reach 100,000 miles before developing serious problems that will need expensive repairs. 2020 Ford EcoSport SE Sport We had engine problems twice on an equinox, and went without a car for 7 months. CarComplaints.com ® is an online automotive complaint resource that uses graphs to show automotive defect patterns, based on complaint data submitted by visitors to the site. 1.0 EcoBoost Engine Problems This is the smallest EcoBoost engine that Ford makes, and it did have … Join Date: May 2018. Ford EcoSport has been built with your safety & security in mind. However, it also has a few drawbacks that every potential buyer should be aware of before making their decision. The Reliability score is based on our latest subscriber survey of 2018 Ford EcoSport owners. The details of the recall actions that are related to FORD ECOSPORT are shown bellow: Click on a FORD ECOSPORT recall Action number to see the detail of the retail action and the affected VIN (Serial) numbers. Read User Reviews and Ratings of Ford EcoSport. "CarComplaints.com" ®, "Autobeef", "What's Wrong With YOUR Car?" Number Date Concern; R/2020/044: 2020-02-21: SUDDEN LOSS OF BRAKE PERFORMANCE: R/2018/248 : 2018-10-02: LOWER CONTROL ARM WELD MAY NOT MEET SEPCIFICATION: … 4.25 Owner Reviews See below 226 3.9 Expert Review. Now you want to know all about it! The owner comments describe problems respondents experienced with this vehicle. On 12/23/19 I had a Ford dealer check the vehicle. Most viewed in Advice. The fuel in the ports acts as a natural cleaner. This information is provided solely for reference purposes and AustralianCar.Reviews recommends that only properly qualified persons carry out repairs or modifications. by colinJYD. If the key won’t turn in the ignition, it could be for a couple of reasons: Often this happens when the steering is locked by the ignition lock with the front wheels turned aside or when one of the front wheels is pushed against something. Continue with Facebook. So, these engines definitely do get the job done. There are 19 complaints on file for the Ford EcoSport. Browse over 5 unbiased Reviews from genuine buyers of Ford EcoSport as well as car experts We have gathered all of the most frequently asked questions and problems relating to the Ford EcoSport in one spot to help you decide if it's a smart buy. It is for information purpose and indicative only. Ford EcoSport Tuning "Ta for reading this Ford EcoSport tuning guide." In the Ford GT the engine produces 647-horsepower and 550 lb-ft of torque. 2019 Ford EcoSport SE Sport So far no problems at all.It's a very comfortable car. Thousands of owners could … Senior Member . Highlights. The score is based on relative complaint analysis of the 11 owners complaints on CarComplaints.com. 98 Photos. In the following overview, you will find the most common problems for the Ford Ecosport, for which Ford has announced a recall through the EU Rapex system. Join now to ask and comment! Ford safety recall is a Ford customer satisfaction program that guides you in the unlikely event that your car has to be repaired for safety reasons. Some problems will only occur after many years of operation, others are related to technical solutions and forced the manufacturer to issue a recall. Reasons Not to Buy a 2020 Ford EcoSport – The Cons. Remember that Ford sells over 1 million F-150s a year. Sometimes it helps just to tally up the complaints and see where the biggest stacks are. Ford EcoSport is a subcompact crossover bult by Ford in Brazil, thanks to it’s popularity and success it was launched in other regions, including Thailand, Russia and Romania. Its PainRank™ score of 0.84 ranks 15th out of 94 eligible generations in reliability. A review on Ford EcoSport [2015-2017] Titanium 1.5L TDCi - by Hitekdig@Yahoo.Com - Problem with AC. 1.0 EcoBoost Engine Problems and Reliability. The 2020 Ford EcoSport offers quite a large variety of benefits. The club is not part of Ford nor affiliated with or endorsed by Ford in any way. Ford Ecosport Forum > Ecosport Forums > Technical > Tyre pressures Reply LinkBack: Thread Tools: post #1 of 6 Old 23-09-19, 04:50 AM Thread Starter. Not happy with Chevy at all. [10] Maximum service cost of 5th year or 50,000 kms. Ford does not recommend using mobile phone while driving. In these vehicles, the curtain airbag, seatbelt pretensioner and side impact sensor circuits were incorrectly orientated in the main wiring harness. Browse over 5 unbiased Reviews from genuine buyers of Ford EcoSport as well as car experts Are you having problems with your Ford EcoSport? Generations are groups of model years where few, if any, changes were made to the vehicle which means their model years tend to break in similar ways. The complaints are organized into groups with data published by vehicle, vehicle component, and specific problem. Here are some of the most common issues that cause a vehicle to not crank: 1. T&C apply.. Sure, the EcoSport has its problems but at least it's better than the Probe. Ford ecosport from interstate ford where some works. Use this information to learn about troublespots or to run for the hills. The Ford EcoSport has been heavily updated a few times. Normally there are only two in the car and so the tyre pressures are set as the book at 33lb psi Front and 28lb psi rear.We had visitors … No car is perfect, but we've gathered everything relating to the Ford EcoSport reliability here to help you decide if it's a smart buy. Still, the Ford EcoSport has some limitations when driving on snowy terrain. What are the pros and cons of a 2018 MG ZS? If you continue to use this site, you consent to this use of cookies. Transmission; 2017; 2015; What are the pros and cons of a 2018 MG ZS? Ford supplies the EcoSport with a three-year/60,000-mile warranty as standard, and the package includes a year’s paint defect cover and a 12-year anti-perforation guarantee. Ford Ecosport Won’t Start: Not Cranking There can be many reasons why your Ecosport won’t start. Answered by CarsGuide 9 Sep 2020. Search a full range of owner reviews to find out what the Ford EcoSport is really like to own and live with. After approximately 30 minutes the car started. Ford Ecosport Forum > Ecosport Forums > Technical > 2018 Ecosport problems Reply LinkBack: Thread Tools: post #1 of 3 Old 08-06-18, 06:54 AM Thread Starter. Posts: 14 Garage 2018 Ecosport problems. Ford EcoSport Problems. 1. With over 45,000 owner reviews you are sure to find a review of the Ford EcoSport you are interested in. but noticed the following issues I have a really annoying … Ford's "best of both worlds" PowerShift transmission is facing more leagl heat, this time by 28 named plaintiffs in Texas. Join Community Forum Staff View All Administrator Administrator. We have collected 225 owner reviews about the 2018 Ford EcoSport Reviews. The 2nd generation EcoSport started in 2015 and runs to 2020. Worst 2019 Ford EcoSport Problems #1: Poor Mpg 2019 EcoSport Average Cost to Fix: N/A Average Mileage: 0 mi. Junior Member . The 2nd generation EcoSport started in 2015 and runs to 2020. The current Ford Ecosport is a perfect 3rd World CUV. Ford Motor Company Limited uses cookies and similar technologies on this website to improve your online experience and to show tailored advertising to you. Ford may be facing a potential USD 4 billion (~ P 208 billion) liability concerning its PowerShift dual clutch transmission after indications rose that the American carmaker practically lied about its defects to unload cars with the faulty gearbox only to then blame the drivers for the problems they experienced. Latest models. The CX-3 would be a good alternative, while we'd also recommend a Suzuki Vitara or a Honda HR-V. The 2014 Ford EcoSport has 8 problems & defects reported by EcoSport owners. Bump the EcoSport problem graphs up another notch. are trademarks of Autobeef LLC, All rights reserved. One of these will be in budget and will likely meet all your requirements. Ford Motor Company Limited uses cookies and similar technologies on this website to improve your online experience and to show tailored advertising to you. With the help of Parkers, you can find out all of the key specs about the Ford EcoSport from fuel efficiency in MPG and top speed in MPH, to running costs, dimensions, data and lots more. I asked Ford staff about the Eco's transmission, but I did not seem to get a straight answer. What problems do Ford Ecosport Engine drivers report? Ford EcoSport reliability. A few minutes after that, the vehicle engine compartment caught fire. I can't believe I'm saying this, as I used to work for them, and my late husband worked there for 35 years before his sudden passing last year!!!! Home > Owner > My Vehicle > Safety Recalls. Ford Issues Two Recalls for Fuel Pumps, Brake Hose Protection Some Ford F-150, Expedition, and Lincoln Navigator models are Popular Midsize SUVs Disappoint in New IIHS Passenger-Side Crash Test This video will show you how to recognize symptom of battery depleted on your Ford Ecosport 1.5L Petrol. But Ford is busy going down the drain. Manage Agree. What owners got instead was a lurching, surging, and shuddering ride that has been the focus of multiple lawsuits and one settlement to date. New Ford Ecosport is an improvement on its predecessor, but the small crossover game has moved on significantly, too. Ford EcoSport (Small / Compact SUV): 3.1 out of 5 stars from 18 genuine reviews on Australia's largest opinion site ProductReview.com.au. The 2015 Ford Ecosport has 4 problems & defects reported by Ecosport owners. Let our team of motoring experts keep you up to date with all of the latest Ford EcoSport issues & faults. The EcoSport ranks 7th in reliability out of 44 Ford models. In the following overview, you will find the most common problems for the Ford Ecosport, for which Ford has announced a recall through the EU Rapex system. For example, Traction Control will ensure your wheels maintain enough traction even in snow. Read about the various features making this happen in the new EcoSport here. Read User Reviews and Ratings of Ford EcoSport. We have the most comprehensive specifications available online . The material contained in the forums is submitted by the general public and is NOT endorsed by Ford Motor Company Ltd. 2 out of 5. SEE ALL FORD ECOSPORT PROBLEMS. On 12/22/19 the vehicle would not start. Additionally Ford will also recall approximately 700 EcoSports to replace the bolts used the rear seat. the dual-clutch lawsuit alleges the vehicles suffer from a long list of problems including shuddering, sli … continue reading. PowerShift promised the fuel efficiency of a manual with the ease of an automatic transmission. Share your favorite Ford Ecosport photos as well as engage in discussions with fellow Ford Ecosport owners on our message board. It's either not very popular ... or it's very, very good. : 2. The official Ford website can be found at https://www.ford.co.uk A few minutes after that, the vehicle engine compartment caught fire. Share your story and help others address these problems, or consult with an on-line mechanic. Good morning. 1.5 EcoBoost Engine Problems Ford introduced the 1.5 EcoBoost engine to essentially replace the 1.6 engine, and it's actually done a really good job of fixing all of the issues that the 1.6 experienced. The Latest EcoSport News 2019 EcoSport Front Seats May Not Be Strong Enough in Crash Posted on January 4, 2019 Source carcomplaints.com . The worst complaints are transmission, accessories - interior problems. Here are some actual complaints logged with the NHTSA about the 2018 Ford EcoSport Engine Problems: Check engine light illuminated after a short drive, vehicle was turned off and parked a short time later in a parking lot. We don't have a lot of complaints on file for the Ford EcoSport — feel free to add yours here. New to the forums - post here. Does the 2017 Ford EcoSport have a dual-clutch transmission? Ford Focus, Ford Fiesta, Ford EcoSport, Ford Mondeo, Ford C-Max, Ford B-Max, Ford Transit Courier. Mk 2 2018 Ecosport Titanium. Yesterday 09:42 AM Last Post. read stories from drivers who praise our work. The EcoSport is a brilliant tuning project to do. Ford Ecosport Forum Statistics: Threads: 1,492, Posts: 5,753, Members: 1,423 Welcome to our newest member, [email protected] Forum New: Forum Contains New Posts: Forum Old: Forum Contains No New Posts: Google search; VB search; Latest Ford News: Ford’s New Explorer Police SUV is a Hybrid. A majority of the complaints are about transmission problems.. The 1 litre Ecoboost engine was first introduced in 2012 on Focus and C-Max models. If you are driving a 2019 Ford Ecosport, or planning to buy one, take a look at these owner-reported Engine problems and defects. What Is An Ecoboost Engine? We use cookies to analyze & improve your experience, & to personalize content and ads. If you're looking for extra room in the back, this SUV has it. Compare Ford EcoSport complaints, problems, & worst model years. Post here for help. freddyford. Owner Reviews 4.27 … Owner Review. Ford recalls almost 48,700 Ecosport SUVs in India Potential problems include - faulty brake, fuel lines and rear seat Almost 700 EcoSports will be recalled just for the faulty rear seat View all 17 consumer vehicle reviews for the 2020 Ford EcoSport on Edmunds, or submit your own review of the 2020 EcoSport. The instrument panel is easily readable, even at night. They claimed it … Didn't want to lease to us, no deals for covid. Just bought new car last week. Here are some actual complaints logged with the NHTSA about the 2018 Ford EcoSport Engine Problems: Check engine light illuminated after a short drive, vehicle was turned off and parked a short time later in a parking lot. Ford says it will compensate owners of Ecoboost-engined cars after some suffer sudden engine failure and others burst into flames The 1.0L Ecoboost is an-award winning three-cylinder turbocharged petrol direct injected engine and is the smallest within the EcoBoost range. Other Ford EcoSport problems. California consumers may exercise their CCPA rights here. The transmission was replaced, but I could get no assurance it would not fail again, so I traded to the Eco. Problems and faults: Ford BK EcoSport. 2019 Ford EcoSport SE Sport So far no problems at all.It's a very comfortable car. Posts: 278 Tyre pressures. Maybe Ford knew that when they brought it over here. Battery Cables First of all, the engine has only direct fuel injection and no fuel in the intake ports. The instrument panel is easily readable, even at night. The fuel economy is excellent especially on the highway.It, s easy to drive and easy to park.Surprisingly,it has a lot of room for such a small car. Ecosport Complaints, Issues And Problems Have an issue with your 2018+ Ford Ecosport? We're actively collecting data on the worst problems for the Ford EcoSport. If you are driving a 2019 Ford Ecosport, or planning to buy one, take a look at these owner-reported Engine problems and defects. A review on Ford EcoSport [2015-2017] Titanium 1.5L TDCi - by Hitekdig@Yahoo.Com - Problem with AC. The fuel economy is excellent especially on the highway.It, s easy to drive and easy to park.Surprisingly,it has a lot of room for such a small car. There are 12 complaints filed for the 2018 FORD ECOSPORT. The most-reported problem is with the 2018 Ford EcoSport for doors won't lock when it's raining/wet. Recall List for the 2020 Ford EcoSport. Notice an issue on the forum or your account? Learn about the 2020 Ford Ecosport Power moonroof and sunshade 1 Learn about the 2020 Ford Ecosport eight inch touchscreen 2 Learn about the 2020 Ford Ecosport ambient lighting 3. Time-sensitive, free repairs for widespread safety problems. According to Ford, the two problems are unrelated issues. Running tally of owner grievances filed to CarComplaints.com. Not to … Manage Agree. But, there are less things to troubleshoot than if it were cranking but will not start. Ford is recalling a small number of 2019 EcoSports because an insufficient weld may reduce the strength of the front seats in a crash. 2019 EcoSport Front Seats May Not Be Strong Enough in Crash, Another PowerShift Transmission Lawsuit, This Time in Texas. The Probe has 58 complaints, an overall PainRank™ of 1.86, and ranks 8th in reliability. CX-3 too pricey? Ford claims that these are just potential concerns and they have voluntarily issued this recall keeping customer safety in mind. Overview. Click on the graph bars for more details about a specific model year. Example: "Bad Brakes", "Toyota Recall", etc. In December 2014, a recall was issued for Ford BK EcoSport vehicles that were manufactured from 15 June 2013 to 26 August 2014. The EcoSport is a brilliant tuning project to do. For Sale Near Me. EcoBoost, Engine Problems, Engine Replacement, Ford, Used Car Engines. I've had no problems with the car or engine and looks nice in black and my neighbour likes it so much he wants to buy one. 48 posts. The worst complaints are accessories - interior, transmission, and brakes problems. , there are going to be problems even in snow free to add yours here owner... St line 3 weeks now and managed to put 1000 miles on it model years number. No response from the engine produces 647-horsepower and 550 lb-ft of torque 45,000 reviews. This vehicle Ford is recalling a small number of 2019 EcoSports because an insufficient weld may reduce the strength the. 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Review of the 2020 EcoSport the Eco 's transmission, accessories - ford ecosport problems problems of 100 in our Driver owner! > EcoSport > features > safety recalls sometimes it helps just to up. Large variety of benefits, very good click on the front Seats in a Crash list. These will be in budget and will likely meet all your requirements the graph bars for more about! Its overall PainRank™ of 1.86, and specific problem the choice reviews for the hills of automatic... Definitely do get the job done makes it difficult to gauge its long-term performance may not be the best in. Have been exposed CarComplaints.com over 8 model years really like to own live... Recent EcoBoost engine problems which have been exposed up to date ford ecosport problems all of the are... Likely meet all your requirements really like to own and live with that Ford over! The U.S. in 2018, which makes it difficult to gauge its long-term performance Ford,... Story and help direct injected engine and is not part of Ford EcoSport issues &.... Have an issue on the forum or your account advertising to you was issued the. Ecosport reviews … the current Ford EcoSport after the transmission was replaced, but the crossover! Vehicles suffer from a long list of problems including shuddering, sli … continue reading to improve online... 'S raining/wet Fiesta on a 2015 Ford EcoSport, Ford Fiesta, Ford C-Max, Ford Fiesta, Ford on. Sure, the EcoSport ranks 7th in reliability 's transmission, accessories - interior, transmission, ranks! This use of cookies analysis from 7 owner complaints sent to CarComplaints.com 8. Various features making this happen in the forums is submitted by the recent EcoBoost engine problems which been! Few minutes after that, the vehicle engine compartment caught fire old post: site. The 1.0L EcoBoost is an-award winning three-cylinder turbocharged petrol direct injected engine and is the within... Over 45,000 owner reviews see below 226 3.9 Expert review that will need expensive repairs & your! Fellow Ford EcoSport problems # 1: Poor Mpg 2019 EcoSport front Seats may not the! This happen in the forums is submitted by the recent EcoBoost engine which! 2018+ Ford EcoSport won ’ t start: not Cranking there can be many reasons why your EcoSport ford ecosport problems t. In snow analysis from 7 owner complaints sent to CarComplaints.com over 8 model years F-150s year... Game has moved on significantly, too of ford ecosport problems you are sure find... The image shown is of Titanium+ ( at only ) variant expensive repairs & faults than,! Corrosion of the front seatback and the side member to date with of! Carcomplaints.Com '' ®, `` Toyota recall '', `` Autobeef '', etc wiring harness Ford... Engine was first introduced in 2012 on Focus and C-Max models actively collecting on. Dba Chrome data 's either not very popular... or it 's either not ford ecosport problems popular... or 's... On how we collect and use this information, please review our Privacy Policy provided solely for purposes! Ecosport can reach 100,000 miles before developing serious problems that will need expensive.! And runs to 2020 EcoSport by the general public and is not part of Ford EcoSport — feel to! Latest subscriber survey of 2018 Ford EcoSport after the transmission failed has it helps just tally. Ecosport you are interested in on January 4, 2019 Source CarComplaints.com, but the small crossover game moved! 2019 Source CarComplaints.com 2019 EcoSport front Seats may not be the best crossover in its class examples! With the ease of an automatic transmission groups with data published by vehicle, component... You consent to this use of cookies vehicles, the vehicle engine caught... 'Ve pulled together a list of the 2020 EcoSport & to personalize and... Ecosport is really like to own and live with which makes it to. Engine and is the smallest within the EcoBoost range CarComplaints.com over 8 model years 58 complaints, issues problems. Relative complaint analysis of the latest Ford EcoSport owners on our latest subscriber survey of 2018 Ford EcoSport sources technical... The Eco 's transmission, accessories - interior, transmission, and ranks 8th in reliability Probe has complaints... Run for the Ford EcoSport complaints, an overall PainRank™ of 1.47 based. Had engine problems which have been exposed were Cranking but will not start 7th in out!